Episode #102: Innovating The Sales Process In 2021 with Chloe Kershaw of Hape Toys
Listen Now
Tap Play Below or Listen On iTunes | Spotify | Google Podcasts
Once you make your toy idea a real product, how do you sell it? In today’s podcast episode we sit down and chat with Chloe Kershaw, the National Sales Manager at Hape Toys. Chloe didn’t start her career in the toy industry...she actually wanted to be a psychiatrist! But eventually, she began her career in consumer goods working in the warehouse of a handbag company. Her curiosity and enthusiasm for the work of the sales team at that same company, led her to discover a career path even better suited for her than tagging handbags.
Chloe shares the steps she took to eventually cross over into the sales side of the toy industry including her joyfully offering to do the grunt work that her coworkers didn’t want to do. Learn what she thinks the heart of a physical product-based company is and why, and walk away with insights on why you might want to start working with a sales rep for your company.
EPISODE CLIFF NOTES
Find out what toy job will have you traveling over 200,000 miles per year. [02:50]
The biggest demotivator to a sales-person [4:42]
The difference between house accounts and a sales representative accounts [07:38]
Get a peak and overview of a toy company sales catalog. [08:39]
An email hack that will help you never leave out an important part of an email again. [16:00]
What Chloe sees as the heartbeat of a company, and what professional experience taught her this [20:12]
Chloe’s FAVORITE part of her job. [22:55]
How the sales and product development teams work together at Hape [24:50]
The different challenges for small entrepreneurs vs large manufacturers in setting up sales systems and processes. [23:38]
What a sales rep group can do for your toy business? [29:04]
Find out the innovative way Chloe came up with to showcase and sell product virtually before everyone was doing it. [35:12]
What Chloe sees will happen in the future now that virtual events have started to come to the forefront of the toy industry [40:40]
What draws vendors to virtual shows? [45:00]
-
This episode is brought to you by www.thetoycoach.com
-
[00:00:00] Azhelle Wade: You are listening to making it in the toy industry episode number 102.
[00:00:04] Hey there toy people Azhelle Wade here. And welcome back to another episode of the toy coach podcast, making it in the toy industry. This is a weekly podcast brought to you by thetoycoach.com. Toy people today we are going to broach a topic that we haven't really touched much on this podcast yet and that's the world of sales. We're really lucky today because I am finally sharing an episode with you that has been sitting in my vault for months.
[00:00:47] Over the summer I connected with Chloe Kershaw of Hape Toys and Chloe caught my eye because she did some really innovative things over the pandemic to promote product when we couldn't meet in person. But you had to wait so long for this episode because we all know our world of 2021 was crazy. There were so many different things to report each week, so much going on, and this episode kept getting pushed back.
[00:01:17] And so for today's episode, you are going to get a lesson into how to be an effective and positive sales manager and leader, how to deal with surprise costs, lessons, and innovation, and how to establish, manage and nurture relationships with retailers. Chloe joins us today to talk about how her career began outside of the toy industry, how it led her into the world of toys and what she does today as a sales manager. Let's not waste any more time and dive right into today's interview.
[00:01:54] Today I am so lucky to be joined by Chloe Kershaw. The national sales manager at Hape toys. Hape international is one of the world's largest producers of toys made from sustainable materials and Chloe is responsible for driving sales for the U S market. While launching her career working inside sales at pomegranate communications, selling puzzles, Chloe quickly found her passion for growing sales in the gift toys and arts industry. As the key account manager for zing, she grew the business through networking, cultivating, and developing many relationships with key players in the industry.
[00:02:30] And with a decade of maintaining those important relationships in the children's toy industry, Chloe's goal is to continue to be hands-on, learn and grow heart-based presence in the U S and as a sales manager. Now, Chloe is joining me today for a conversation on how sales has changed and evolved over the past year and where it could be going in your to come. Now, I have to say I met Chloe on all places club house, and I would say we immediately had a connection right off the bat. We talk product development, sales, inventions, and it wasn't long before I invited Chloe to be a guest on this show to share some of her insight into what it's like to work the sales side of the toy industry. Chloe, thank you for being here. Welcome to the show.
[00:03:16] Chloe Kershaw: Thank you so much for having me. It's such an honor.
[00:03:19] Azhelle Wade: Chloe, you're a national sales manager at Hape toys, but some people listening to the podcast today may not know what that means. So can you start by giving us an idea, just what you do day to day?
[00:03:32] Chloe Kershaw: Yes, of course. So the reason why I love my job is because every day looks a little different. I work closely with our global team in China and Europe. So depending on the team and the project, I wake up anywhere between 4:00 AM and work up until midnight, even later, I know.
[00:03:48] Azhelle Wade: What? Chloe!
[00:03:50] Chloe Kershaw: I know. Well, when you're working with all these different times zones, it's hard when they're in the office and everyone works with each other's schedules. But my focus is US sales. So I manage about 150 outside sales reps nationwide. And my goal is to drive the strategies and initiatives for us to hit our us goals. So to do that, I'm very involved with all of the different departments internally, and I love being hands-on and customer facing.
[00:04:15] Which is something I've always enjoyed. So typically I travel a lot, but because of the pandemic, I got a nine month break, which is really to just relax and stay at home. But I got the itch in January, so I started traveling again and it's really great to get back out there.
[00:04:30] Azhelle Wade: For work for a leisure?
[00:04:32] Chloe Kershaw: Both.
[00:04:33] Azhelle Wade: Both. Okay. Well, you made me think of so many questions in that whole intro. So number one, why don't you define what's a lot of travel for someone working in sales?
[00:04:44] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. So domestically before the pandemic, I was doing about 200,000 miles just in a year, just in the U S alone. And then I would go to Europe and China, so that doesn't even include like international travel. So I do a lot of trade shows and then a lot of visits to corporate accounts. So the corporate account visits is what racks up the miles.
[00:05:05] Azhelle Wade: So when you're saying corporate account visits, you're going to corporate offices meeting with potential customers or current customers to show them the product I'm assuming, but people might not know what that means. So that's why we got to break it down. Now you said something in there in your intro that I was like, what you did you say you manage 150 sales people?
[00:05:26] Chloe Kershaw: Yes. So no, all of our outside sales reps. So we have 10 different rep groups that we work with and they divide up the the country. So 10 different territories and every rep group is the size is different. We have a gentleman who manages upstate New York and he's just one guy. And then we have a rep group who manages Tola and me, which is like the south. And there's their rep group is about 20 to 30 people. So just depending on the territory and the people, the rep group size varies.
[00:05:55] Azhelle Wade: So you are leading all these different rep groups. What is your role in leading them and leading their activities? Do you give them timelines to hit? Numbers to hit? What do you do with them?
[00:06:04] Chloe Kershaw: I do both. So at the beginning of the year, while we lock it in November, December, and then in January, I send them their forecast and say, this is our goal. So this is where I need your team to do. And this is how I think you can get there based on what we did last year and the year before. So I take a lot of the KPIs and metrics that we have in our system. And I go, this is achievable, you know, and I am the kind of sales manager that wants you to hit your targets. I do like the sandbag a little bit. I know there's people out there that probably just cringed, but I truly want our goals to be realistic.
[00:06:37] And then let's shoot for that, you know, that extra mile at the end, because the worst thing as a salesperson is to get this big, giant target. And every day you to see a red number, red number, red number. I really truly believe that if we're going to put a goal out there, it should be somewhat achievable. It should be a challenge, but it means, we should be able to meet it. Unless there's crazy things that come up like our containers situation that we're dealing with right now. So you know, we want to make sure that our reps are set up for success and they're excited to hit their goals and they want to get my emails.
[00:07:09] So I give them all different types of tools, like a sales manual that they have, that they carry with them for the entire year. It has all of the brand new products that we introduced. It has our terms of sale. It has all of our discontinued items are priceless. The do's and don'ts of, how to navigate certain conversations of, you know, the difficult conversations that come up with retailers, like we do have the conversation of Amazon. You know, when we're working with our specialty retailers, we know that there are some problem items on Amazon. We want you guys to stay away from those items and not order them.
[00:07:42] So here's the page of items that are kind of the Amazon products that maybe we can help navigate you away from and choose these items instead. It's the way I like to describe it is like, when you look in a beauty magazine and you have that nutrition guide and it's like, instead of a bagel eat this, instead of this, eat a banana. And so it's been working and the reps appreciate it and the retailers appreciate it. So yeah. And then I send out emails and basically just let them know like, The internal information that's happening and I just push it out to them. So that way they can get to do their job.
[00:08:15] Azhelle Wade: So I, I want to dive into how you have this like modern marketing approach to your job that I don't believe. I mean, I don't know every national sales manager at every company, but I don't believe many people are implementing because let's be honest, our industry, isn't very hip to like modern technology. And I think I see you have these elements of very modern approach where you are building community with tools that people normally associate with like a lack of community, like email people feel it's not personal, it's not as personal as a phone call, but
[00:08:46] I know that you are really building a sense of community even digitally, which is really cool. But I don't want to get into that yet cause I still have more questions about the sales managers you manage. Okay. So, all right. I want to talk about humanity. You managing all these different rep groups. How much of a touch do you have with your actual customers? Like the retailers since you're traveling so much, is that because you're going to all these meetings with, along with the people that you manage to support and take notes and all that is that what's happening for you?
[00:09:17] Chloe Kershaw: I do both. Yeah. So I have a rep to accounts and then we have house accounts so a rep the account means that it's managed by an outside sales rep. And then the in-house accounts means that it's managed by somebody who works for the company on the company's payroll. So I'm on the company's payroll. So I have some house accounts that and then also any account that's managed by an outside rep I support. So it's a little toy store and down your street, or if it's a big box store, I can support you on any meetings virtually or in person. So I really am here to support every single one of our sales reps for any, any of their needs.
[00:09:54] Azhelle Wade: In my experience, because I'm from the other side of industry, like I'm creating the products, I'm building the brands. I might be building the decks that you're using to pitch, but what are some needs that your sales reps come to you and you help them with like, what kind of fires do you put out on a regular bases?
[00:10:10] Chloe Kershaw: There's customer service fires with shipping or, you know, products not being on back order. And just the kind of like the standard things that you hear of. But where I think my, you know, specialty and expert is, you know, really getting the tools that they need to get their job done without having to ask me. So we, where is it? I'm like we have a little manual that I make every single year and it's pretty large. Yeah. And it's really nice. It's spiral bound. And we print these and we give them to every single one of our outside sales reps. So inside it has little key table contents. So you have all the information learning about the company.
[00:10:46] So if you're brand new and we're onboarding new, you can have background information about who we are? How to contact us? All of the awards we won last year. We also have all of our new products introduced. So this is 2021. Yeah. And then once we get further into things, we start going to our best sellers. In this page we have our best sellers. You just flip to page 23, and then we have our best sellers, our terms of sale. You know, just anything you need to get going with a customer. So I like to anticipate the questions that are going to be asked of me, because I feel like if I'm getting questions asked, I did not do my job by giving you the imperfect information that you need to do your job.
[00:11:34] So my job is to premeditate. Okay. What are the first questions I'm going to be asked when I introduced this? And so I sit there and I think about, okay, what questions would I ask if I received this? So I try to anticipate every question. That's going to come my way, because can you imagine I manage 150 outside sales reps. If I left out one thing, I'm going to get 150 emails about the thing I missed. So I really try to eliminate as much confusion as I can.
[00:12:04] So intentionality clear communication is very important. I reread my emails a million times. On occasion you're going to still see a few mistakes here and there, but you know, I'm human. But yeah, I really just want to make sure that they are sales reps do not have to do anything, but go in and sell. Like, I don't want them wasting their time having to like source materials and tools and get things together. I want to give it to them so they can just hit the ground and go.
[00:12:30] Azhelle Wade: Is that normal? Would you say that's a normal level of commitment and material supply that a sales manager does? Are you going above and beyond? Are you type in this?
[00:12:39] Chloe Kershaw: I don't know. I would like to say a lot of sales managers probably provide a lot of materials, but I do hear from our sales reps that have a use that has go a little above and beyond to get them what they need. And it's very much appreciated. And we do also send out like weekly reports to our sales reps that they're very grateful for that they say, oh gosh, I wish other vendors would do this. And you know, everyone has their own team and everybody has certain levels of like, what can we do and what can we not do?
[00:13:08] And it all comes down to time and the resources. So I understand why some companies don't do it. And some companies aren't big enough of to you have to do things like this because we have 385 items in our line hundred and 50 outside sales reps. You're a startup company probably don't have to go to this extent, but to the point of having a giant catalog, it's really helpful to have these types of streamlined tools.
[00:13:34] Azhelle Wade: Know, I have to say, like having started a small business starting systems and even automations early on is just so beneficial. So I do think that even some small companies listening today can take notes from you. Just, I mean, why not establish these systems? Even if they only had one or two sales reps, they could minimize the communication needed. Because if you're that small of a company, you're an entrepreneur wearing so many hats.
[00:13:58] You don't have time to answer questions about your product. You want them to be able to sell when the iron's hot and not be waiting for you to, to respond. Have you ever thought about, or are you looking into ways to automate some responses to some questions or to some emails or things?
[00:14:12] Chloe Kershaw: Yes. I was thinking about going and working with calendly, somebody sent me one and I was like, this is the coolest thing ever. So of course I looked into it and I got busy and I haven't had a chance to like actually set it up. But I have monthly one-on-ones with all of my outside sales rep principals. And for those of you who don't know what that is, principals that the owner of the rep group.
[00:14:34] Azhelle Wade: I love it.
[00:14:34] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. So the principals, the owner of the rep groups, which is who I managed directly, and then the reps who are underneath them are called sub reps. So I have monthly one-on-ones with the principals. And so scheduling those one-on-one. Takes so much time out of my day. And so I was thinking I listened to another podcast and it was the topic was, you know, how to be more efficient and use your time wisely and all the minutes that are wasted in a day, by doing tasks, you don't really realize you're wasting your time on. And I realized I'm wasting so much of my time scheduling meetings and how can I streamline this? So Calendly is going to be my new best friend and I just need to like slow down and take a night, set it up and get it going.
[00:15:15] Azhelle Wade: Yeah, do it. There's this, saying, I heard that was saying, you know, when you're looking at all of your to-dos and trying to decide what to do next, you should actually choose the tasks that once you do it is going to multiply your time in the future. So you might be saying, oh my gosh, I have to set up like four meetings with different sales reps. But if you stop and you say, or I could instead get Calendly situated, because what that's going to mean is in the future, I will four X your time later on, right? It could four X, multiple it'll multiply your time later on.
[00:15:46] Chloe Kershaw: You know, a lot of people work traditional nine to five and I've always worked from home. Cause my office is in Canada that I report to and I live in Portland, Oregon. Being that I've always worked from home and everyone was working office hours. People would get home and maybe someone would work late at night on occasion, but because people are doing at-home learning and their schedules are a little bit off. I'm getting emails around the clock. And then with our global international teams, I'm getting emails from them. For a while there I was working 19 hour days just being like, this is not sustainable. How do I do that? Cause I just, I'm the kind of person that's like, if somebody sends me an email, I need to respond back to them instantly.
[00:16:26] And this last year I've learned like, okay, it's okay to work at a 10 hour work day have respond instantly to somebody's email. Like I can probably wait until the next business day.
[00:16:39] Azhelle Wade: Because they're not going to do anything with your response most likely until the next business day. Right? Exactly. That's so true. I hope that you do get to take your 10 hour work day and keep it. But I hear you sometimes I used to look at emails and just knowing what the person is asking and knowing what I would want to respond would keep me so mentally preoccupied that I'd be like, you know what? I might as well just sit down and respond because I'm just obsessing over it. But then I got into this weird cycle where I needed to respond immediately.
[00:17:13] Like I felt like I had to respond immediately. And then I wasn't the quality of the responses weren't always great. And then I was actually emailing more because I would have to like clarify things or whatever. And so that's when I decided like, you know what, I'm not open an email, unless I am ready. Like I have a designated time to like go through my emails twice each day, three times each day, where it's like a clear, like email time.
[00:17:36] Chloe Kershaw: Absolutely. I do that. I do the same thing. Cause I, you know, sometimes you missed a really important like part to kind of validate your response or like justify what you're trying to explain or give the reason why somebody should buy your item. And you're like, oh, I left out like the zinger at the end, dang it. Like, that's the best part. And I left it off. So I do the same thing and I actually kind of take what I do is I copy somebody's email and I paste it and then I start to respond based on, in a different color. So that way I can literally respond to their questions and then I delete what they wrote and then I forward that email and then I will change it to black and then I send it off and then I can read.
[00:18:20] Azhelle Wade: That is a good one. Okay. I can't believe you've been said that because for the longest time with product development, that's how most of the communication works with China, where they'll ask a question and then you'll say, you know, see my responses below in blue and you'll answer directly in their question, but I never even thought about deleting their question to create a whole. That's so good.
[00:18:39] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. Cause that is literally keeping the email going and you're responding to their questions. Exactly what they asked and you know, you're not gonna miss anything. Cause the worst thing is, especially when you're working with a buyer or a retailer, you know, you don't want to waste their time. So when they ask you, when they take the time to write a long email, I want to be really thoughtful with my response and make sure I don't miss anything because I get phone calls and emails and Skypes and you know, all these different things just coming in all the time. And it's so easy to get distracted when you're in the middle of writing an important email. So that's a little trick to help me stay focused.
[00:19:16] Azhelle Wade: You weren't always in sales though. So I do want to get a quick background on where did you start? Cause there might be some people listening that are like, I'd love to do sales in the toy industry, but I'm not in the toy industry. So how did you get into this industry?
[00:19:28] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah, so I actually went to school for psychology thinking that I was going to become a psychiatrist and the summer after my senior year, I worked in warehouse for a handbag company called Ellington handbags in Northwest Portland, Oregon. And that is where I interacted with a sales team for the very first time. So they would come down into the warehouse, you know, like any salesperson and warehouse employee, you have that relationship with like, oh, Hey, this order needs to leave today. And so like I talked to the sales team, they email me, they come down and pull stuff for the trade shows and you know, our warehouse was pretty cool. So they would come down and just hang out on a Friday just to kind of like escape the office environment. And I loved the sales team. I was like, how do I get their job? Because I would see them traveling and I hear their conversations. And like, I want to be just like them.
[00:20:15] Azhelle Wade: Wait. Do you remember some kinds of things that you heard that were like, oh?
[00:20:19] Chloe Kershaw: Well, they just go to trade shows and they talk about their business dinners and this and that. And I'm like, I want that, like, you know, like the glam, if I had sale, like sound of the sales life, and then you start living it and you're like, okay, it's not a fancy, as I thought it was still super cool. So I just envied them. I was like, these people are so cool. I want to do what they do. And so a job opening came up in the retail store, which was connected to the corporate office cause the warehouse was a couple blocks removed. So I ended up working in the retail store and I was even closer to the sales team because we are now connected and their offices were in the back and they'd come out in the front.
[00:20:58] You know, there you'd have customers come in and they meet with people. And I literally just like attached myself to them and I eat lunch with them every day and I've listened to their conversations and I'd ask questions and I'd asked if I could sit in their sales meetings. Cause I want to learn like what they did, what were they talking about? And and then finally, like I was hearing like, I hate cold calling. I hate having to do this. I don't like doing this.
[00:21:21] This is such a waste of time. I'm like, I'll do all of those things that you hate doing, like set give me your groundwork. So in the retail store, there's a lot of downtime. So I'm like during my downtime, I'll do the cold calling. I'll clean up your spreadsheets. I'll do this. And eventually I got a desk in the back of the sales team and I remember my very first day working with the sales team. And basically that was that.
[00:21:44] Azhelle Wade: You love your first day. Was it what you thought it would be?
[00:21:47] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah, I remember I walked to a local bagel store and I got a bagel and cream cheese in a coffee and I'm like, I've made it. This is my life. I'm like I'm walking to work in Northwest Portland, Oregon to my little job and I have a desk to go to. It just made me so happy.
[00:22:05] Azhelle Wade: You are making me like tear up. So sweet.
[00:22:07] Chloe Kershaw: It was fun. But I mean, the fact that I worked in a warehouse too, I don't think people know that about me. And being that I have that experience of knowing what a warehouse employee goes through is so important because I think a lot of like the heartbeat of a company is a warehouse because they're the people who receive our product and they push out our product. Sales is super important. Operations is super important, but they're the true heartbeat of the company that weren't for them, we would not be able to get our product out to our retailers.
[00:22:39] So I think sometimes there's people have really high expectations of a warehouse and they don't actually know how much work it truly is, or the logistics or operations that go behind having to prepare orders to ship out. So I'm always very compassionate and sympathize when we do have like discrepancies or during our busiest time of year, it's like, yes, this is realistic turnaround time because I actually have lived it. I know what it's like to be in a warehouse and have to ship out, you know, 500 orders a day and it's a lot of work and, you know, they don't get a lot of praise. So I always like to give a shout out to the warehouses out there.
[00:23:16] Azhelle Wade: So in the warehouses that you're talking about, where they shipping direct to consumer or to big retail clients?
[00:23:21] Chloe Kershaw: So I started that. We did B to C and we did a lot of you know, B2B as well. So yeah.
[00:23:29] Azhelle Wade: So 500 orders, like mixed, like some going to client, some going to.
[00:23:33] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. I remember working in the warehouse and we sold to eBags and I remember having to put all the eBags stickers on it. So like, you have just like a basic white poly bag that you that's like just a standard color and to brand it with their logos, you had to like put certain eBags stickers in certain places based on eBag requirements. And that took forever. And you're like, if you didn't put a sticker on, in the right place it went to a secret shopper. You would get deemed as this kind of crazy.
[00:24:02] Azhelle Wade: Oh my gosh. Wow.
[00:24:03] Chloe Kershaw: I mean, this was a long time ago, so I don't know if that's the way it is anymore. I haven't worked in a warehouse in a long time, but yeah, there's a lot that goes into your shipping out orders. And so the sales team in a warehouse works really closely together and it's important that we respect each other and understand both pressures. Cause like sales has a lot of pressure, but the warehouse also has a lot of pressure to meet the timelines and the ship dates and the cancel dates and all that.
[00:24:28] Azhelle Wade: So my next question for you was actually, what do you think makes you really fantastic at your job? But I'm wondering if it's part of this?
[00:24:38] Chloe Kershaw: Is a good question. I struggle with this question cause it's hard for me to be like, what am I good at? But I love people and I love selling toys and I love making people smile. And so I think my favorite part of my job is showing a customer a toy they've never seen before and watching their face have that like aha moment of like, wow, when they watch the magic unfold. It just brings me so much joy and like, I love being serious, but I love to be able to like get down and play and like have a good time and being able to have that balance of both and sales in the toy industry, lets me also be me without having to like, b2 buttoned up. You get to actually play and have fun and laugh at work. I think that's what makes me really good at my job is I can actually play with the toys.
[00:25:27] Azhelle Wade: So that sparks a question in me. Do you ever have any influence over the kind of products that hoppy develops just based on the sales numbers that you're seeing? Like, do you ever give suggestions like, oh, we should make a product at this price point or product of this category?
[00:25:43] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. So our product development team first off is amazing. We have a really great group of people. We actually just had a new woman join. I can't say anything yet, but her joining the team is going to allow us to really expand and tap into kind of a channel that no one in the toy industry has been able to tap into. And it's really exciting. It kind of introduces culture and education, and just more inclusivity, which is really great. So more to come on that, but we always have product development meetings. So whenever the product development team has new concepts, they bring each sales team from every market and they get their comments and feedback. So yes, absolutely. My feedback is well received and they welcome it and they asked for it.
[00:26:30] And there's been times where I've said, Hey, let's create something more like this, because this is what the consumer wants. But, you know, it does take our team a while to put that into development because there's so much that goes behind it as you know. They're very receptive to everyone's feedback and they always are wanting to make sure that we're launching the best products. The safety testing is perfect, we pride ourselves on the quality. So we really do like to make sure we slow down and the product development process is truly done from start to finish perfectly. Which is really great that they take all of this into consideration and they also hold focus groups with moms and dads, with children of these ages to get actual consumer feedback, to help improve the products that we have. So, you know, they really pull information from so many different groups.
[00:27:21] Azhelle Wade: That's fantastic. Okay. I want to flip this conversation to focus on the sales side of the industry, cause I've just been fan girling over you this whole time. Pretty much. So let's talk about what everybody wants to know. For all the new entrepreneurs that might be listening, what would you say are the biggest differences in sales when you're working at a large company like hoppy international, versus when you're working, when you have a startup company and you're just starting to figure out sales for yourself?
[00:27:51] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. So the overall infrastructure, I would say it takes time to build up a startup and there's so many awesome opportunities that you have when you're working in a startup, you all have to wear a certain, like you wear so many different hats. And you get so many different types of experiences and departments that maybe you would never even touch. And maybe you learned something about yourself that you didn't know, you love doing, and you learn a new function. Also when it comes to startups, you know, maybe you don't have as big of a budget as somebody who is bigger than you. And so there's all different types of things, but I would have to say that working with a larger company, there's a lot more layers to things.
[00:28:31] There's a lot more internal processes. There's a lot more approvals that need to be done. Things take a little bit longer, but that's totally okay. You know, I worked in a startup and I've worked at a big company and I like both, you know, I think it really comes down to the management and the ownership and the ownership that Hape is just so supportive. And he's so giving and his passion for toys and wanting to create quality toys for children at all price points, because his philosophy is like every child deserves a well-made toy, regardless. Like it doesn't matter what your income level is, you know, every child deserves a toy and it should be made well.
[00:29:12] And so I love that and I love being able to stand behind that. And the fact that we've always been so big on sustainability and having eco-friendly made products. I think it just depends on like, you know, who are you working for and what does that ownership look like? So I think that it, you know, cause you could work for a small company and there could still be the same level of approval processes depending on the person who runs it.
[00:29:34] Azhelle Wade: They're like super controlling. Yeah.
[00:29:37] Chloe Kershaw: I've been there. I worked at one.
[00:29:39] Azhelle Wade: Oh my gosh. Yeah. So I'm wondering how much of sales work, do you think that a solo toy printer can do on their own? And when should they start reaching out to rep groups? Start reaching out to people to help?
[00:29:52] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. So I love this question. Because I think that everybody has their own limits and own capacity. So like, what are you already doing? Are you running? Are you doing your bookkeeping, payroll product development and everything else on top of sales, that's probably not realistic for you to do at all. Like as much as everyone wants to be like wonder woman and Superman, you know, we all have to have a balance and we cannot do it all. I went through a business coach a couple of years ago. And the thing that my biggest takeaway from her was, say, no, it's okay to say no.
[00:30:23] It's even okay to say no to your boss because your boss wants, or you yourself. If you're the boss, you need to be the best version of yourself. And you need to still remain an expert. The moment you start saying yes, and taking so much on you are just going to drown yourself and burn the candle at both ends. And you're no longer going to be that expert that you once were. So the moment you become honest with yourself and you're like, wow, I can't keep up. That's the moment you need to hire somebody.
[00:30:51] Azhelle Wade: I think the problem is for most people is they don't know what they don't know. So like what could it say you're you think you're doing sales okay. But if you hire a sales rep group, what kind of things would they take off your plate?
[00:31:04] Chloe Kershaw: Oh, they would be able to call customers for a credit card. They would be able to show customers your product. They would be able to write the orders for you. They would be able to deal with any sort of like customer service type inquiries. So of course they might have questions for you, but you can get them the answers. And then the rep would do all the communicating with the customer. So once you get the information to the rep, basically, The reps doing all of the communication for you on your behalf. So they are representatives of your company basically acting as of contractors for you. So they're not on your payroll day, but just be like a 10,99.
[00:31:40] Azhelle Wade: And additionally, they can knock on doors and try to help you obtain new clients.
[00:31:44] Chloe Kershaw: Absolutely. Yes. New and existing business. And it's really great because they're the ones who are out there who live in the territory. So they are the ones driving around town. They see the new toy store, they see a new pharmacy, they see an opportunity, oh, this item would be great in a hardware store. Maybe there's a new sales channel that you didn't even think of that their sales rep is like, there's a big opportunity here. I'd like to start selling to this type of retailer and that can really help you brainstorm and you know, more outlets and where you can be.
[00:32:14] Azhelle Wade: So are your sales reps picky about who they went to work with?
[00:32:18] Chloe Kershaw: Sometimes. Yes, and I think that's a good thing. I wouldn't want a rep group just to want to take every single line because then where do you fall in line of priority over all these other lines? So we have some reps who only have like seven to 10 lines and we have some rep groups that have like 60 to 70 lines. So it really just depends on the rep group and who they are and how many people work for them.
[00:32:40] Azhelle Wade: So do you have any tips for startup entrepreneurs who want to reach out to a rep group to show up as their best selves so that, you know, if they're available, if they have opportunity, they can see the potential in their business and maybe take them on.
[00:32:53] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. I think that the first thing everyone looks at is are you representing somebody who would be considered our competitor? That's the first thing that you want to kind of look at? Like, okay, let's look at your line mix and see if you have anyone who's a competitor. If they are chances, are they already have an existing relationship? They're already doing business with them. They're not going to drop them to bring you on. So I would say if you're okay with them still selling. Them and you and them. And the right thing to do is to also go to that other vendor who would be considered a competitor and say, Hey, we're thinking about picking up this line, you know, are you okay with it?
[00:33:30] Cause you don't want bad blood in the showroom you want. I mean, it's a small industry. We all need to get along. So I would say, yeah, put together a packet and say, this is what we have to offer. We'd love to start working with you. Can we have a conversation? Can I invite you to our booth? If you're at a trade show and walk you through the booth so you can see our products. If you're not going to be at a trade show, sending samples is a really good way having zoom calls just having that initial relationship conversation to figure out. Do you guys work well because it's kind of like a marriage. You're working very closely with everybody and it's a friendship too, because you have the same goals.
[00:34:08] But you're really busy and you will need to make sure that you're talking and sometimes you get so busier, you're like, oh gosh, I've gone four weeks without talking to you. We need to have a check-in just to like catch up and see what's going on. And the better relationship you have with your outside sales reps, the better they're going to be for you. Because they're going to feel more invested. They like you. I know that our sales rep get a thousand emails a day and I really try to stand out. And I created a little newsletter from it's called like the update from Chloe, which was kind of hard to keep up. Cause I'm not super big on social media. So I was trying to get my reps to get to know me a little bit more and yeah.
[00:34:44] So I'm like, okay, how can I get my reps to be excited about getting my emails and saying like, oh, here's another really long boring email from Chloe. So I do a playlist. I do like Friday pump up playlist or like, Hey guys, we're X dollars away from meeting our sales goal this month, let's turn it up. Here's some pump up music for us to like hit the ground running. Or if you're dragging in your car, here's a playlist cause they're always on the road. I mean sometimes add little things on the bottom of my emails, like a meme from a movie and guess this movie. And if you do, I'll buy you a drink the next time I see you. And people respond and I love it. And it's fun because then the Redskin learn about me and my kind of silly, goofy side. But then at the same time, I'm sending out really important information that I'm like, I need you to respond back to me. So, because you were responding to this, I know you read my email.
[00:35:33] Azhelle Wade: This is exactly what I'm talking about. What really stood out to me about you is how you're really taking on digital marketing and applying it at a corporate level. So you are understanding your customer. And I mean, I'm saying this is your customer, even though these are sales reps, because this is how I see it. I normally tell my students know your ideal customer and then know how to talk to them, know how they spend their time driving, you know? No like how they're going to be receiving your messages. Like, so, okay. They're driving. What do they want when they're driving a playlist?
[00:36:01] You know, find ways to connect with them. You know, doing their everyday activities. And then you're doing this like weekly email and you're branding it with your personality. You're theming it with yourself and you're giving people something to look forward to in these emails. Like you're, you're creating a brand. You're a brand is a feeling that somebody has when they think of you. And you're creating that with these emails. And I know I already want to ask you about like that virtual show that you put on that we talked about offline blunts. I mean, you are doing it, and this is a hundred percent, I think where the toy industry is going to go in the next, five years. It's going to this, you're essentially doing social media and email it's genius. I mean it's fricking genius. I know you might not see it as genius, but as genius. Okay. So, so tell me about this version. You know, what for sure I'm talking about? Yeah, you told me, yeah, from past conversations, you said you came up with something really innovative during the pandemic to generate sales for Hape and that story was because another show was canceled and you needed something to replace it. Right. So what did you do?
[00:37:06] Chloe Kershaw: Okay, so ASTRA canceled and they were kind of on the fence of canceling, not canceling. And we weren't really sure what was going on. Cause this was like so fresh at the beginning of the pandemic, like it was April and we're like two and a half weeks in to all the lockdowns, things were changing so quickly. And I knew that the trade show is going to get canceled. I just knew it. So I was like, we need to act now we need to be one of the very first people to just say, okay, we're not going. And we need to figure out how we're going to still get in front of our customers. So I asked my boss, I sometimes come up with crazy ideas and I don't know why he says yes sometimes, but I'm glad he did this time.
[00:37:44] He doesn't always say yes, I get told no pretty often. But so I called him and I was like, Hey, I think we need to ship a pallet of product to my house. I'm going to set up a showroom and I'm going to do little like a YouTube library and I'm going to turn our catalog into a digital catalog. So that way I am literally demoing our best sellers. I have a table out in front of me, so I don't have like the tools or the materials, or like a studio at my house to have like some fancy, you know, set up. So I got my ladder in my garage and I set my ladder up in my living room. I moved all of my furniture out of my front room. I took down all the pictures and everything, so it was just clean slate.
[00:38:27] And I put product everywhere. And I was recording video after video, after video and I created a YouTube channel and I broke out all of the entire catalog. I was like really struggling with these videos because you're redoing so many retakes and I was trying to get them within like one to three minutes each. So I wouldn't bore the customers watching, and my husband walked in and I'm like, I just can't do this. This is so much harder than I thought. I don't know what I signed myself up for it. And I had to complete this project and he's like, here have a drink. My husband used to be a bartender. So it made me a cocktail.
[00:39:03] Yeah, I know. And so he made me a cocktail and we were sitting in the room and I was like, okay, I need to get back to it. And then I'm like, but wouldn't it be just so much easier if I just like, cause my front door was in this room, like, what did it be so much easier if I could just like invite somebody in and I could just like walk them around the booth, like, and have a virtual trade show. And I was like, oh my gosh. They could ring my doorbell and I can invite them in my living room. And I can literally do this. over zoom. So I called my boss again, can we create a campaign called the dong campaign? And I do a live zoom call where I have a table set up.
[00:39:38] I have all the products in the living room. The product's already here. It's not going to cost you guys any money. It's just my time. And I want to do it for one for week. I want to market it, I'm going to advertise it. I want our sales reps to join in and bring their customers just like they would at a normal trade show and we have meetings. And I literally just talked to you about our best sellers, the upcoming sales promotions, anything that you guys need, if you're concerned about your business, because you're closed and you don't know how to move forward, I'll be astounding. I'll just be like a seven to talk to. Like you don't even have to talk about, you don't have to write an order, just join me on zoom and let's talk.
[00:40:15] And so I created 16, 30 minute time slots for seven days. I filled up all of them from Monday to Friday, which also I'm like, I should probably have accounted for like maybe having to go to the bathroom and also having like a bite to eat in between. I was so busy and it felt like toy fair. It was crazy, but I was in my own home, which was so cool. People connected and our sales reps came in we had retailers come in and I was pushing it so hard. And I was literally like, this is either going to be the best idea I've ever had, or it's gonna be the worst idea I've ever had. If it was the worst I'll never talk about it again, but you're talking about it right now. So.
[00:40:54] Azhelle Wade: Chloe.Yeah, you're a visionary, you're a visionary. It like, I mean, to see what month was this?
[00:41:01] Chloe Kershaw: It was in June. So I advertised it for six weeks before, and we didn't in the middle of June.
[00:41:07] Azhelle Wade: And what I love about this is like, hape is a huge company, but you did a grassroots effort. This is like, they have platforms for this now to make this easier that people can do the same thing that they have virtual showrooms now. But for companies that can't afford those virtual showrooms, this is a grassroots version of that, that you can make happen by marketing to your existing contacts, marketing on LinkedIn marketing through your email marketing, even on social media, paid marketing, like there's so many different ways you could advertise something this simple and have it be so effective. Like, so, I mean, Chloe, I'm just expecting to either see you running a multimillion dollar company that you built yourself or being the head of or this toy company in the future. So I just already know, I'm really glad to be connected to you now when you're, when you're still humble. So.
[00:41:58] Chloe Kershaw: Oh my gosh. Seriously. I don't even know I want to do that.
[00:42:03] Azhelle Wade: You're going play. I have so many really good tools and things I want to just share with you at some point that once you see the things that these tools can do, you're going to just have so many more ideas for how you can grow your sales. So I think this necessity obviously is built this innovation for you, right? It's like fired up this idea and this need for innovation. So how do you see sales changing? Now based on how virtual events have come to the forefront. So you were a leader in this, but now we see their actual platforms built out for virtual events. So what do you think is going to happen in the future?
[00:42:39] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah, good question. I think both, I think there's room for both. I truly believe that there's value in the in-person meetings. And then there's value of having the virtual meetings. In fact, I was just talking to our team yesterday. I been traveling a lot this summer, so I've been on the road on and off, and I'm totally falling behind just because it's like, I was locked down at home, just like only working. That's all I did to now actually having to go in and out of an airport, getting an Uber check into my hotel. And then there's like so much time that you're not sitting in front of your computer able to respond because you're just on the go. And so I think that there is so much value in person and in virtual because people used to go to Hong Kong, like three to four times a year. I don't really see the need of going to Hong Kong three to four times a year anymore.
[00:43:30] Now that we're having more Microsoft teams calls with our global team and we're getting, I mean, we still need to go. Witch it's still important to at least make one or two trips a year, but we don't need to go four times a year anymore. And it saves the company money. It saves us on time. We're more efficient, we're more productive. There's so many benefits to virtual platforms, but there's also the benefit of being in person and reading somebody's body language. Shaking their hand or giving somebody a hug or putting a toy in somebody's hand that maybe they wouldn't necessarily touch or be interested in.
[00:44:03] And they're like, whoa, okay. This is pretty cool. You know, they were on the fence about it at first and then they touch it and they're like, oh, okay I changed my mind. I mean, that's how we sell is you put it in somebodies hand and you met the magic unfold and you can't do that over zoom. And one zoom call in particular really stands out when I was in the pandemic. So we were meeting with a buyer. And it was a group of them and they had their cameras off and I was trying to sell to them with their cameras off. And it was very difficult because salespeople need the engagement of like, okay, body language.
[00:44:38] Azhelle Wade: Are they paying attention? Are they not? Like, do I have to change my angle? Like. Yeah.
[00:44:43] Chloe Kershaw: Totally. And like when you're in a boardroom and you go into a corporate meeting, you put all your toys out and you're talking about things, but the buyers might be reaching for toys. You're not already talking about it. You're like, okay. Note to self, they like that note to self. They touch that. Even if you don't have a chance to talk about it, they expressed interest because they touched it. So you're like, there's, there's something there. They liked it. So with the zoom call, you don't have that. You only have the time that you have, you have one frame, it's one dimensional and you don't get to be hands-on. And so the in-person has to stay. And it's, I think we all know that, but I also think that there's a space for virtual because it, it does allow us to be very productive and balance our work and everything.
[00:45:25] Azhelle Wade: So I actually wonder, because I think going virtual made you realize that the value of in-person, but did going virtual make you realize ways you might tweak your in-person presentations differently.
[00:45:40] Chloe Kershaw: Yes and no. We have so many items in our lines, so it's so hard sometimes to narrow it down. So when you're walking through our booth, it's so easy to get distracted because there's 385 items. So going into these virtual meetings, you know, you're very focused on a topic. So a question that I now asked before going into a meeting, but instead of being like, oh, let me just show you all the new. It's like, do you have any success categories that you'd like to us to focus on?
[00:46:07] Are there any themes that you are focusing on that I should make sure I add into the presentation? I've always asked this, what type of ages are you looking for and what price points? Those are like the two obvious ones, but. More of the asking questions ahead of time to the buyers. So that way I can just use their time as wisely as possible because their time is so valuable. I don't want to waste it. So if they say they have 15 minutes, I want to get as much as I can in 15 minutes.
[00:46:31] Azhelle Wade: No, that's, that's really smart. All right. My last question, do you see like what do you think the new purpose is going to be for in-person or virtual shows? Because like, you know, for different shows have different vibes to them, like the Dallas Toy Preview, you feel like you're going to see like cool innovations early Astra. It's more that specialty field near toy fair. It's like a heavy marketing push, right? Obviously they're all focused on getting orders, but do you feel like there's a specific vibe that virtual shows are going to start to be known for?
[00:47:00] Chloe Kershaw: I hope so. Cause that's what I love about trade shows is the energy that they give off. So I think that that is something that maybe the virtual shows are lacking. Astra did do a virtual show twice. They did Astra summer camp and also Astra winter camp. And I think they did a really great job of bringing the community together and, you know, having these after night, like networking events Scary stories. They did, their lifts seen saddle that they normally do. They had an award ceremony and so they did a really good job at keeping the show almost exactly the same, but just putting it on a virtual platform where we could still stay connected and people can chat in the comments and all of that.
[00:47:38] So I haven't really been involved in too many other virtual platforms cause we kind of just did our own thing and then we participated in Astra. But if they, I think that that would be a big draw for a lot of vendors is, you know, we do like the networking part of it. And also knowing that, you know, we can get new customers. That's a big reason why people go to trade shows to attract new customers. How would it be true that on a virtual level, we usually only go to who we know. Right. Right. Person. You're like walking by a booth and you're like, Ooh, what's in there. And then you're not going to click on this booth. Because you don't know what it is.
[00:48:15] Azhelle Wade: Exactly. The exploration part. Like has to be built up and clear. Yeah. That's almost like we need like a virtual show with like an Instagram Explorer page, right? Yeah.
[00:48:26] Chloe Kershaw: I think we have some development under our belts right now.
[00:48:30] Azhelle Wade: Yeah. Oh my gosh, Chloe, this was the best conversation. You are just a shining star. Is there anything that you would like to share that's going on in your life or maybe with hape that you want to tell the world about?
[00:48:43] Chloe Kershaw: Oh, gosh. Let's see. I, haven't just working as hard as I possibly can to make sure that I make all of the retailers happy, which is not always something I can do. But yeah, we're feeling really good about our inventory levels, which makes me really happy and proud to say. Because I know a lot of other companies aren't necessarily in that same position as us. So the owner of our company, he basically like at toy fair, said. The pandemic is hitting COVID is a thing. And our factories are closing and we don't know how long they're going to be closed, but the moment they come back, we're starting up our production line and we're going to continue to manufacture our goods and we're going to continue to ship inventory to you.
[00:49:23] So he front loaded a ton of inventory. Wow. Way before, almost like you knew it was going to happen. It's like, I think he has a crystal ball or something. He put us in a position where we had a ton of inventory. It was really great that he had this forward-thinking and brought inventory into our domestic warehouse and, you know, yeah. So we are in a great position in we're struggling just like everybody else to get containers. And we're really grateful for that. So.
[00:49:51] Azhelle Wade: Oh my gosh. Real quick, the container issue, how did you handle that? Like, are you guys just holding to order? Because I know like, the prices are like, some people say for X they're getting costs, are you splitting costs with retailers. Like I know some companies are, or are you just saying, you know, we're trying to wait it out because we're so good with inventory.
[00:50:12] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. So we are in a position where we had to do a price increase. So we actually just announced it on the 16th of July. And we're giving everybody a 30 days notice. And then anything that ships after September 15th will be honored in the grandfathered pricing and then anything that shifts after nine 15, then that will be on the new pricing. We only did a price increase across the third of the line, so we didn't have to do the whole line, which we're really happy about. Yeah. And so we basically, what it comes down to is we just had to cube out the containers to see like, which items are landing higher and why. And so we basically just based on the weight and the dimensions and the product, it's like, okay, this is what needs to happen because, it has to land a certain way otherwise, We lose and we can't lose.
[00:50:57] Azhelle Wade: I was just like running fake numbers, honestly. And I was like, if it's this big versus this heavy, but sometimes you have like a smaller electronic item that you can retail for like $50. So then that's okay. But if you have a bigger, cheaper item it is like turning everything we used to do on its head right?
[00:51:13] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. And some items have more margin than others. And so, you know, you're just like, okay. So what we ended up doing is, it's anywhere between the 5% and 30% increase, depending on the item. And honestly, I didn't know what to expect when we sent out the price increase announcement and we are so lucky we have some of the most supportive retailers and the best reps in the world. There was no push back.
[00:51:36] Azhelle Wade: They're like, yeah, we're just not going to order those 30% one.
[00:51:44] Chloe Kershaw: We're still keeping all of our current programs and we're still keeping everything else the same where I've heard that some companies are charging like a surcharge and they're removing free freight. And there's a lot of these being associated to it on top of the price increase. And I always tell people it's not as simple as just doing a blanket flat, like five to 10% price increase because it's like children, they're all different. You know, each child is different, each product is different. So we gotta treat them each individually to figure out like, how do we make it work on each one? Then again, we wanted to make sure that all of our retails were still really competitive. So that was really important to us.
[00:52:20] So it's like, we look at the price increase and then we look at the MSRP and we're like, okay, can we do this? Does this make sense? Will this still sell. So, you know, we had to have a lot of discussions. It was a big part of like our process. So we were thinking about doing a price increase in April and it took us a while to figure it out because we really wanted to make sure we did it right. Hopefully we did because we haven't gotten any pushback or complaints. And it's really amazing. Cause you know, every company is going through this and I think our retailers are at that point of it's just happening. And you know, their costs are going up to their payroll taxes are going up, their employee wages are going up, their gift wraps going up, their leases are going up.
[00:52:59] Everything's going up. So what retailer pointed told me something, and it spoke to me, who's like, you know, an item that was my best seller, 10 years ago that I had to sell a hundred ads. I now have to sell 300 apps because my costs keep going up. If you don't raise your costs. And I was like, wow, like light, like just turned on here. This is crazy. Yeah. And then when you put it into that perspective, it's really interesting when you start thinking about it. So price increases are necessarily a bad thing, right?
[00:53:26] Azhelle Wade: It's true. Yeah.
[00:53:27] Chloe Kershaw: Yeah. We just shouldn't be so afraid of it because everybody's costs are going up.
[00:53:31] Azhelle Wade: Thank you for this conversation today. You're fabulous. I'm just really excited to know you so happy to have you in my circle. Where can people connect with you on LinkedIn? If they want to connect with you?
[00:53:41] Chloe Kershaw: LinkedIn is a great place to connect with me. Thank you so much. And you are amazing as well. I feel so lucky to have met you, like in such a great way to run clubhouse, which is like a platform where you go to connect with people that blossom from it really?
[00:53:56] Azhelle Wade: Thank you so much, it was a pleasure having you. I will put your link in the show notes until next time. Take care of Chloe.
[00:54:01] Well, there you have it toy people. And that was my conversation with Chloe Kershaw. before we dive into a summary of today's episode, I've got to give a shout out to a listener and new member of the toy coach podcast, Facebook group, James Brand. James joined the Facebook group recently, and he's been working on a few innovative toy ideas and shared some things in the group that everyone loved. So I wanted to give you a shout out, James and say, thank you for being a part of our group. I wish you the best with your toy ideas. I hope a toy company sees you soon and discovers what you have to offer.
[00:54:37] Now, let's talk about this incredible conversation we had today with Chloe. There were some really great points we made throughout the entire conversation, but I am going to highlight just for. First, Chloe mentioned the heartbeat of a toy company being the warehouse. And what I love is that her understanding of what it takes to pack and ship products, to get them out to customers, allows her to be a more sympathetic sales manager and have a better relationship with the people that are shipping out the product that she is selling.
[00:55:09] The second part of our conversation that was incredibly valuable, especially for new entrepreneurs out there is to understand what sales reps can do for your business. And when you might think about hiring one. We often want to think that we can take on the whole world in our small businesses, that we can do it all ourselves, but it's important that we know when to bring in help.
[00:55:31] And what was really valuable today is that we learned what that help could look like, what it could bring to us, and a sales rep group can not only help you manage existing relationships, but help you form new ones. The third thing we talked about today, which really was the inspiration for me having Chloe on the show is how she innovated early on to create a virtual showroom.
[00:55:56] And honestly, at that time when she did it, it wasn't a thing. It really wasn't a thing for our industry. Virtual trade shows and virtual showrooms are starting to become more of a standard now. But what I hope you learn today is how to be flexible and innovative and listen to your gut, especially when times are changing. You've got to learn to listen to your gut so that you can prepare a contingency plan when you have a feeling that things might not work out as they always had in the past, both Chloe and the owner of Hape seemed to have that golden gut to know exactly when it was time to make a change and do something differently to keep the business moving forward even in uncertain times.
[00:56:42] Now, at the end of our conversation, we did have a little talk about the importance of virtual shows versus in-person shows. And will we keep having virtual shows now that we're starting to go back to in-person and yes, we found that both shows virtual and in-person are helpful, but they do have very different vibes. Virtual shows have the ability to create new opportunity to help us for new relationships really quickly. So if virtual events moving forward are designed to be focused on the fun and the networking of them, that is what could potentially draw vendors to these virtual shows.
[00:57:28] Activities that are focused on socializing, making new connections, maybe not initially sales focused because virtual shows the speed of them. And the ease of them actually lend themselves very well to connecting with and meeting new people first and foremost. And then those deals could potentially be solidified at in-person shows. Well, that's all I have for you today toy people. As always thank you so much for joining me here today. I know that your time is incredibly valuable and that there are a ton of podcasts out there. So it means the world to me that you tune into this one. Until next week, I'll see you later toy people.
-
🎓Learn more about how you can develop and pitch your toy idea with Toy Creators Academy® by clicking here to visit toycreatorsacademy.com and join the waitlist.